Equipment Progression

[Nurvus]

By all means, this is no buff/nerf thread, and the fact that I'm comparing Quivers does not mean I favor Ranged, but just think it is the best and clearest example for the point I want to make.

I have noticed some odd values in some equipments.

Example:

Gazelle Hide Quiver
Cost: 14950
Rock: 5
Prereq: Archery (30)
Range Haste: 12%
Armor Class: 14
Int: 1 Cnc: 2

Lifemud Quiver
Cost: 16590
Rock: 4
Prereq: Archery (31)
Range Haste: 10% (Worse)
Armor Class: 13 (Worse)
Dex: 3 Cnc: 2

Then it jumps high:

Mare Catcher Quiver
Cost: 18440
Rock: 4
Prereq: Archery (33)
Range Haste: 15%
Armor Class: 19
Str: 1 MSt: 2

Feather Woven Quiver
Cost: 19900
Rock: 3
Prereq: Archery (34)
Range Haste: 12% (Much Worse)
Armor Class: 15 (Much Worse)
Int: 1 Cnc: 2 Agi: 1

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- All Uncommon
- All found in the same store.
- The price keeps getting up.
- The Requirement keeps getting up.
- The stat bonuses get slightly more appealing. (But not enough to make much difference in our purchase choice)
- The weight gets slightly lower. (But not enough to make the slightest difference in our purchase choice)

And as they require higher Archery and are more expensive, it would be acceptable that some stats might "not" improve. But to become actually worse is a little too harsh...

Unless there's some hidden power to some of them, I see no reason whatsoever to ever "wait for" or "replace the previous Quivers with" the Lifemud Quiver or Feather Woven quiver...

They are more expensive and are weaker than the previous quiver.

[[[Even for a meleer who might pump Archery skills high for the Ambush bonuses into a first Auto-shot, then switch to the Auto-attack for the rest of the fight, it still is not worth it...]]]

Is it intended to be like this?

I could give some more examples - some weapons do not seem to evolve in a particularly balanced way.

And please understand I try to see things from several perspectives, trying to anticipate the possibility of a given item favoring a class more than another, like some bows/arrows with higher Minimum damage being more appealing to Rangers, while bows/arrows with higher maximum damage being more appealing to Archers.

I asked this question a few days ago in game. If you look at the stats at the bottom of each item, you should factor that in as well... some of the "weaker" items have stat buffs superior to lower levels - whether its a satisfactory compensation or not, is debatable.

I'm no expert on the details, but I dont see it as worth it, even considering the stat boosts. But I could be mistaken - I'm just stating my own observations.

[Nurvus]

I did mention them, if you look closely.

The main point is not about how good they are.
The main point is that an item that - price-wise and requirement-wise - should be better, is actually between "just as good" and "worse"...

In my opinion, an item with same price and higher requirement should already be better (with the same rarity), so a higher price, higher requirement item should be visibly better, even if just by a little, not "just as good" let alone worse!

I really don't see anyone skipping the Gazelle Hide Quiver to save up for Lifemud Quiver, or skipping Mare Catcher Quiver to save up for Feather Woven Quiver...

And even if by some miraculous chance someone manages to get +1 point in Archery without noticing (at 30+), enough to somehow not notice they could've gotten the "cheaper" quivers, they'll still get off better taking the cheaper quiver...


Sure, the 3rd quiver has stat bonuses that do not benefit casters much. But the price increase, requirement increase, along with weaker % and armor, in exchange for less weight and a minimal stat boost is, in my opinion, not a tradeoff worth looking at.

Are you trading 3% range haste & 4 armor for 1 Int and 2 Cnc?
Or perhaps you'd trade 2% range haste, 1 armor & 1 int for 3 dex?

And don't forget, the Gazelle and the Mare quivers are cheaper than the next, not same price...

So even if they "even out" in attributes, it's not a fair deal.

But hey, I'm not crying about item stats.
I'm just trying to discuss the item stat policy. Whether it may have been a mistake - wich I am more inclined to believe - or if they are really meant to be like that...
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I'll give one final example (Town 2):

Ornate Ancient Copper Ovaline
Price: 15870
Weight: 13 Rock
Prereq: Blocking (33)
Armor Class: 164
Int: 2 Agi: 2 MRe: 1

Rune Enchanted Steel Buckler
Price: 17040
Weight: 13 Rock
Prereq: Blocking (34)
Armor Class: 143
Int: 2 Cnt: 3 Dur: 1

Both Uncommon.
Will you say that +1 Blocking requirement, ~1100 additional price, and -21 Armor Class are there to compensate the difference between 3Cnt+1Dur, and 2Agi+1Mre?

thats what i mean by debateable - but it is the explanation offered by jeff here