Crush Update

I'm not asking for a buff or anything but just more crush weps.

Is this it for crush weps? (neglect all the useless 2h's in the list)

Weapons - Nodiatis Wiki - Glitchless MMO of Nodiatis, the land the gods forsake, A java powered MMO wiki
even in the beginning, crushers have it hard


Here is the damage output for weps-- compare with the slashing epics vs crush (assuming str maxed out the damage)

level min max delay
Blood Claw 15 4 40 28

that comes out to [4 + 40 (1.5)]/28 or2.28 damage/delay~lets also add the bleed effect which does around .28(8)/28 which is an extra o.08/delay, coming out with 2.36/delay

Ball and Chain 22 3 46 36

With a ball and chain, it is [3 + 46(1.5)]/36 or a flat 2/delay


Now i understand slashers wont have this weapon out for long and they advance to ZC's so lets compare

Zombie Scale Claw 28 11 84 42

The ZC is very very powerful. Look at the numbers. [ 11 + 1.5(84)]/42= 3.26/delay with its epic effect that gives .42(13)/42 = 0.13, with a total of 3.39


I know that the ball and chain is just a lv 22 uncommon weapon but crush at that level is just less than appealing. Even BC's outdamage it so all I am asking is for a larger variety of crush weps. The 2h's are fails when you compare DPS

RDS (2H) 34 1 32 14
It comes out to 3.5damage/delay.

Jagged Tooth Mace 35 3 40 18
This also comes out to 3.5 but lv 20 dual weild makes it 1.6 stronger so its actually 5.6. If we raise the bar to lv 40 DW, it makes at 1.7x stronger at 5.95.


There should be more 1h crush weps to dual weild. 22==>35 is a huge jump so it'd be great if there's a crush wep in between that could at least beat a lv 15 BC. The 35's are nice and slightly stronger than ZC's.

I was happy to hear that the 59 crushers are better than the 52 BCA's but then.. the 81 slashers come in. Even at first glance, you can see that they are stronger than the 59 crushers so please please please give us weapons that can use. Preferrably in the epic category.

Slash has a wide arrangement of epics and then look at crush...

What do you think?

Around level 60+ is when crushers really shine, along with the crush proc.

thats the ONLY time crushers shine. then they are done in by the 81 slashers at lv 70. kinda stupid really.


edit: slash spec raises slash minimum damage too so 81 slashers are especially deadly. by the numbers, crusher's are /pwnt.

same with the bows... they got 78 epic bow which also beats the 59 crushers.. really sad


and ONLY 1 OWNAGE EPIC!! the 71s a disgrace


I'm not asking for a buff. just want MORE crush weps.

Originally Posted by klippi

thats the ONLY time crushers shine. then they are done in by the 81 slashers at lv 70. kinda stupid really.


edit: slash spec raises slash minimum damage too so 81 slashers are especially deadly. by the numbers, crusher's are /pwnt.

same with the bows... they got 78 epic bow which also beats the 59 crushers.. really sad


and ONLY 1 OWNAGE EPIC!! the 71s a disgrace


I'm not asking for a buff. just want MORE crush weps.

Magic users only shine at the end-game. What's your point?

read the last line.

There are less staffs than any weapon in the game, you don't see casters complaining about that.

because they are all 2h's and they must use 2h's. crushers naturally want to do damage and because of that, they want DW.

Originally Posted by klippi

because they are all 2h's and they must use 2h's. crushers naturally want to do damage and because of that, they want DW.

They don't HAVE to, it's only preferred and recommended.

Don't forget, casters use staffs as an extra boost to bonuses, DPS, and the skill bonuses.

The same reason crushers use crushers.

Someone who is really proficient with crushers please post in here to show Klippi that crushers don't "suck" as much as he claims.

I got the numbers. You cant argue with numbers.

edit:

Originally Posted by klippi

I'm not asking for a buff or anything but just more crush weps.
RDS (2H) 34 1 32 14
It comes out to 3.5damage/delay.

Jagged Tooth Mace 35 3 40 18
This also comes out to 3.5 but lv 20 dual weild makes it 1.6 stronger so its actually 5.6. If we raise the bar to lv 40 DW, it makes at 1.7 stronger at 5.95.

in a talk with morrodin a few days ago, he said crushers were the absolute best at the end of the game...with slashers at a close 2nd. i don't know enough about the game to support his point, but it seems pretty clear from the overwhelming amounts of people who favor crush that it really doesn't need a boost.

also, don't neglect the max damage boosts... even the 5% over slash is huge if you add in the enormous strength bonuses crushers can have. remember slashers MUST invest in dex, and a fairly good amount of it. crushers can go all strength. 100 extra points of strength, stacked on top of the warrior's 15% max bonus and crush's 25% bonus...is pretty big.

Originally Posted by Tapobu

in a talk with morrodin a few days ago, he said crushers were the absolute best at the end of the game...with slashers at a close 2nd. i don't know enough about the game to support his point, but it seems pretty clear from the overwhelming amounts of people who favor crush that it really doesn't need a boost.

here are the numbers for the 81 slashers (epic class)


Haunted Totem Sword 81 12 106 22


[12 + 1.5(106)]/22

with .22(29)/22

8.06/delay


compare it with the 59's


Blood Spike Mace 59 11 104 25

[11 + 1.5(104)]/25

6.68/delay


There you have it. The 81's are 20.65% stronger than the 59's. It should be clear that the 81s are stronger.

Originally Posted by Tapobu

also, don't neglect the max damage boosts... even the 5% over slash is huge if you add in the enormous strength bonuses crushers can have. remember slashers MUST invest in dex, and a fairly good amount of it. crushers can go all strength. 100 extra points of strength, stacked on top of the warrior's 15% max bonus and crush's 25% bonus...is pretty big.

Lets also take into consideration slash spec adds to the minimum. That cancels out the crush spec. Crush just has a harder Std deviation and slash is more constant.

Dex wont take much of a toll on slashers. especially when they can use that dex for a bow first shot. Many melee's wont use this because it costs too many trophies but it really is worth the investment.





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BTW im not asking for a buff.

You are using the lower crushers, try using the better ones.

yeah, you left out pretty much all the modifiers i mentioned. i think there's a warrior bonus in there? but you left out the slash vs crush spec, and the fact that more strength is available to crushers. chances are there will be higher level 1h crushers since many new high-end epics have been discovered, and even if not...you can always use uncommons. comparing an 81 to a 59 is ridiculous in and of itself, especially when better options are available. i've seen many high level crushers using solar implosion clubs...they must have had a pretty good reason for ditching the epics.

Originally Posted by Tapobu

yeah, you left out pretty much all the modifiers i mentioned. i think there's a warrior bonus in there? but you left out the slash vs crush spec, and the fact that more strength is available to crushers. chances are there will be higher level 1h crushers since many new high-end epics have been discovered, and even if not...you can always use uncommons. comparing an 81 to a 59 is ridiculous in and of itself, especially when better options are available. i've seen many high level crushers using solar implosion clubs...they must have had a pretty good reason for ditching the epics.

What should i compare the 81 epics to? I'm comparing the best of crush to the best of slash..

The modified help out the slashers more. Notice their decently large minimum damage.

I just realized the 84s are stronger so lets lets compare

Godspeed Crusher 84 13 121 26


[13 + 1.5(121)]/26

Thats 7.48/delay. That still less than the slash 81s



edit: Look i don't want an argument on which wep type is better. read my post again and respond correctly.

Originally Posted by klippi

What should i compare the 81 epics to? I'm comparing the best of crush to the best of slash..

The modified help out the slashers more. Notice their decently large minimum damage.

I just realized the 84s are stronger so lets lets compare

Godspeed Crusher 84 13 121 26


[13 + 1.5(121)]/26

Thats 7.48/delay. That still less than the slash 81s



edit: Look i don't want an argument on which wep type is better. read my post again and respond correctly.

You forgot the added effects, such as the crush proc. That proc lets you stun the enemy, I think that is very useful.

Let's see, crush proc+ crush spec+ hemorrhage+ critical strike+ overcrit+ strikethrough+ runes=massive pwnage.

That's the math you should be using.

before you ask for more crush weapons, call up the wiki and look closely. i'll help you.

Weapons - Nodiatis Wiki - Glitchless MMO of Nodiatis, the land the gods forsake, A java powered MMO wiki

notice the list of crushers across from the significantly shorter list of staves. scroll up and you'll find a slightly-longer-than-crush list of slash next to a rather diminutive list of pierce. scroll down and you'll find a rather miserable list of whips.

edit - sherman, the crush's stun thing isn't that useful, considering the resist-crush auras that now exist. but you're right, it is pretty important, at least in pve.

Originally Posted by Tapobu

before you ask for more crush weapons, call up the wiki and look closely. i'll help you.

Weapons - Nodiatis Wiki - Glitchless MMO of Nodiatis, the land the gods forsake, A java powered MMO wiki

notice the list of crushers across from the significantly shorter list of staves. scroll up and you'll find a slightly-longer-than-crush list of slash next to a rather diminutive list of pierce. scroll down and you'll find a rather miserable list of whips.

edit - sherman, the crush's stun thing isn't that useful, considering the resist-crush auras that now exist. but you're right, it is pretty important, at least in pve.

But how many people can use 92 grey to get the nearly always active crush resists at this point?

not so many, but i know of some who have at least the 50%'s.

Originally Posted by sherman

You forgot the added effects, such as the crush proc. That proc lets you stun the enemy, I think that is very useful.

Let's see, crush proc+ crush spec+ hemorrhage+ critical strike+ overcrit+ strikethrough+ runes=massive pwnage.

That's the math you should be using.

You really wana compare?


hemo gives a bigger buff to slash than crush
Crit strike gives slash a LARGER boost

overcrit gives a percentage boost so crush is getting the shorter end of the stick.

strikethrough cancels out

crush proc is nerfed because of that aura gem

Runes give SLASH a bigger boost because it is, again, a percentage boost.


Did i leave anything out?

Originally Posted by klippi

You really wana compare?


hemo gives a bigger buff to slash than crush
Crit strike gives slash a LARGER boost again

overcrit gives a percentage boost again so crush is getting the shorter end of the stick.

strikethrough cancels out

crush proc is nerfed because of that aura gem

Runes give SLASH a bigger boost because it is, again, a percentage boost.


Did i leave anything out?

You forgot not everyone can use the high level greys to make the proc useless.

Also, crushers have the higher max damage IIRC.

They get the bigger boost.

Might be why they are used more.