Ripping Off the Bandaid

[Jvance]

This is wrong I and many others rerolled their toons to BM based on the results seen in other BM;s when I took stalking to 100 it was based on the hit speeds I was getting on my pets and after investing hundreds of dollars and crap tons of effort to build this guy up, BAM my kill times are 40% slower because a your mistake.

Not only do I feel ripped off because now I kill soooo much slower than when I was a crusher I have little to no faith that another investment into a reroll would not just be in vain. I understand this is the way it should have been, but I spent that time, effort, and money based on the way it was. Something needs to be done this is too big of a mess up to have the "my bad" solution we are getting

[ForumPipe]

**** happens.
Life sucks.

[LadyGaGya]

Glitchless' post on this references a post reporting the problem 5 years ago. It also says roughly - Well, you should have expected this. What a cop-out. If i had the skills to wrap my head around NOD's fuzzy math, I'd be making MMORPG's, not playing them. It's like I bought a car that ran fine for 5 years, then it was recalled and ran 40% crappier after the recall, and the dealer told me "Well, that's the way it was always supposed to run. I'd be like "Well you're supposed to buy me a new car!
This is a complex game, which is it's attraction. I can understand how it would be easy to miss something like this. But after 5 years, it's no longer a glitch, it's a game feature. I bought a Lexus, so why stick me with a Pinto?

[Huggles]

07-03-2009

Stalking is created
http://forums.nodiatis.com/forums/sh...light=stalking

_____________________
12-19-2010

Team Kyron fights 108 boss. Pets do not appear to have increased delay. Unlikely that all three toons have 0 stalking. Bug likely already in existence. Based on this evidence, it is likely that stalking never added any delay.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWtAzDfPUaw

____________________

11-18-2012

Worgen added. Balance shifted greatly in favour of BMs. (Stalking is assumed to be functioning incorrectly at this point).
http://forums.nodiatis.com/forums/sh...ad.php_t=14415

___________________

8-20-2014

Stalking bug found and patched. BMs lose a large amount of their power.

___________________


The problem with the end result is that Glitchless had made most classes relatively balanced prior to the fix. Of course, BMs were much stronger than most other classes, but not 40% stronger. Because of the fix, BMs are significantly weaker than most classes. Had this been introduced with the January patch, a fix would be correct.

However, upon learning that this is a 5 year issue, I must say that the correct fix would be to change the skill description and mechanic to simply double damage and intimidate stun duration while slowing non-whip users by 15% and whip users by 10%. Additionally, the Pet Haste gems should be removed from the game and Helkok Instigators should be returned to pre-Aug 20 status.

The other option is to have Stalking function as it has for the past 5 years and 2 months, with no affect on delay, and instead buff all other classes. However, this would likely negatively affect tanks in PvP and lead to more TC inflation and trophy deflation.

Either way, I do not believe the 40% slow should be in effect.

[Excellence]

Maybe not 10% slow, but like 20% or something. Returning state to previous would be sweet, I mean pre-helkok buff and that. I'm primarily not BM and this doesn't affect me much but after talking to few people and seeing their point of view I felt bad for them. I know I'd feel like that if something similiar about DoTs happened and I know I invested millions in my DoT gear just because of that unknowing bug. Nerfing Stalking slow would make things a bit more balanced and would calm down people that are obviously upset.

EDIT: Also yea, if that happens, removing Pet Haste would be fair

[Akilthedestroyer]

Okay, for once.. Thank you Nibbles! And I like his idea for once.

[Akilthedestroyer]

Originally Posted by LadyGaGya

Glitchless' post on this references a post reporting the problem 5 years ago. It also says roughly - Well, you should have expected this. What a cop-out. If i had the skills to wrap my head around NOD's fuzzy math, I'd be making MMORPG's, not playing them. It's like I bought a car that ran fine for 5 years, then it was recalled and ran 40% crappier after the recall, and the dealer told me "Well, that's the way it was always supposed to run. I'd be like "Well you're supposed to buy me a new car!
This is a complex game, which is it's attraction. I can understand how it would be easy to miss something like this. But after 5 years, it's no longer a glitch, it's a game feature. I bought a Lexus, so why stick me with a Pinto?

^^^^^^^^ Seriously, you nailed it.

[adino]

What I inferred from the post was...... stalking was basically working fine until it was "tweeked" in the news years patch. So, I guess we are supposed to think that BM's are back to what they were last December????? Come on man!!! And if so then why the need for new gem line and kok buff. Once again...COME ON MAN!!!!

[Excellence]

What Nibbles is saying is that this bug existed ever since Stalking was introduced, and he thinks he found evidence.

[adino]

Yeah I understand that but, that is not what glitch said. I was responding to the reason the admin gave. I do believe Nibbles is correct.... which just adds to my... come on man (ESPN NFL countdown reference for those who don't know)

[Jingo]

Originally Posted by Huggles

07-03-2009

Stalking is created
http://forums.nodiatis.com/forums/sh...light=stalking

_____________________
12-19-2010

Team Kyron fights 108 boss. Pets do not appear to have increased delay. Unlikely that all three toons have 0 stalking. Bug likely already in existence. Based on this evidence, it is likely that stalking never added any delay.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWtAzDfPUaw

____________________

11-18-2012

Worgen added. Balance shifted greatly in favour of BMs. (Stalking is assumed to be functioning incorrectly at this point).
http://forums.nodiatis.com/forums/sh...ad.php_t=14415

___________________

8-20-2014

Stalking bug found and patched. BMs lose a large amount of their power.

___________________


The problem with the end result is that Glitchless had made most classes relatively balanced prior to the fix. Of course, BMs were much stronger than most other classes, but not 40% stronger. Because of the fix, BMs are significantly weaker than most classes. Had this been introduced with the January patch, a fix would be correct.

However, upon learning that this is a 5 year issue, I must say that the correct fix would be to change the skill description and mechanic to simply double damage and intimidate stun duration while slowing non-whip users by 15% and whip users by 10%. Additionally, the Pet Haste gems should be removed from the game and Helkok Instigators should be returned to pre-Aug 20 status.

The other option is to have Stalking function as it has for the past 5 years and 2 months, with no affect on delay, and instead buff all other classes. However, this would likely negatively affect tanks in PvP and lead to more TC inflation and trophy deflation.

Either way, I do not believe the 40% slow should be in effect.

support

[Huggles]

2-10-2013

Andresan reports problem with pet delay not working as expected.

http://forums.nodiatis.com/forums/sh...ad.php_t=14977

[Tharkas]

There was a thread that, if i remember correctly, was talking about how it USED to be beneficial to not have stalking at 100 but instead to be kept lower. If anyone knows what i'm talking about and can point me to that thread i'd appreciate it

[Glitchless]

It's quite possible the bug existed before the New Years patch. We don't have a way to know other than the videos Huggles timed, which seem to indicate it did, at least for whip users.

There was no solution that would please everyone. Our choice has been to correct the mechanics of the skill to match the description, partially because it was so universally accepted and complained about by the player base that BMs were the far superior PvE solo farmers, and this bug helped us reconcile that perception with our mathematical projections. That is not the end of our actions, however. We have already buffed the Hellkok whip, the reason for buffing it and not the other whips is due to it being the only one that relies on pet damage as a high % of a BMs total damage - remember only your pets attack slower now, so only at component of damage has been reduced. At this point we do not believe that it has been buffed to the point that it should be chosen over all other LG whips for all situations. If that proves to be the case, we will buff the other LG whips.

We have also introduced a pet haste gem that is superior to melee and range haste equivalents.

These changes are not meant to bring a BM build exactly to its former status, of course, and that is because we have acknowledged the need to balance a BMs PvE abilities better with other builds. This is likely not the end of our changes to BMs either. They very likely will need a buff in PvP. BMs still have a lot of empty skill slots for us to add interesting abilities that they may now actually deserve, whereas before their further development was stifled by their own power.

[Glitchless]

Also would like to add that we have been very impressed with the response of players to this patch. For the most part, the complaints have been fair and voiced without being overly abrasive. We acknowledge that it is entirely our fault that this bug existed in the first place, and do not expect anyone affected by it to be completely free from rage.

[hotshot64]

Originally Posted by Glitchless

Also would like to add that we have been very impressed with the response of players to this patch. For the most part, the complaints have been fair and voiced without being overly abrasive. We acknowledge that it is entirely our fault that this bug existed in the first place, and do not expect anyone affected by it to be completely free from rage.

*rages* Jk I agree.

[Tharkas]

Found the thread i was looking for.
http://forums.nodiatis.com/forums/sh...ad.php_t=15802

Your response to this thread made me believe that you had inspected Stalking had fixed it. With that in mind I thought that all BM's skills were working properly..... Maybe the name "Glitchless" should be changed to "Lessglitchy" since there still seems to be glitches in the game

[Master]

you gonna get the hammer!

[Tharkas]

Well if he can't see the fact that I'm picking on him with that last part I'll take the hammer

[Glitchless]

The name Glitchless was always meant more as an aspiration than a status.